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If the Electoral Roll debate was torrid, then the problem of recycling direct mail has the potential to be cataclysmic. Last month's shock quip from Michael Meacher, minister of state for the environment, that he'd like to see 70 per cent of all direct mail recycled - and have the industry pay for it - sent tsunamis, not ripples, though the direct marketing industry.

At a time when the DMA was in the middle of delicate talks with DEFRA (the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs), the soundbite has thrown into question its preferred, and some would argue lame by comparison, targets of 27 per cent recycling by 2005 and 45 per cent by 2010. Was this really a serious comment or - no pun intended - a throwaway remark?

In an exclusive interview for Marketing Direct, we put this and other questions direct to the minister. Quips can be ignored, but heartfelt beliefs about how the DM community should act are another matter. And this interview turned out to be one frank talk.

"There is something of a stand-off between my views and those of the DMA," says an unreserved Meacher. "I think the DMA is still reeling from the shock, but the recycling figures it suggests are pathetic. It has to be higher, and I have yet to get a satisfactory level of agreement."

Meacher's choice of words are not accidental. At the heart of the impasse is his belief that too little is being done too late. The UK has one of the worst recycling rates in Europe. It is a quarter that of Sweden and Germany's, and by 2016 EU law will force Britain to cut the 80 per cent of waste going into landfill by 33 per cent. The growth of direct marketing is not lost on Meacher who links its contribution to the three per cent rise in household waste a year. Worst still, he doesn't even believe the current cited level of DM recycling is true.

"The DMA quotes a 13 per cent recycling rate but this is more akin to the figure for all waste as a whole," he says. "What the industry is doing is nil. It is not funding councils to deal with it, and it is not helping in collection. Instead, the DM industry has been piggybacking on top of the taxpayer for too long and expecting others to pay for it."

Meacher's notion that generators of direct mail take advantage of other recycling schemes they don't have to pay for is precisely why Meacher thinks producer responsibility must apply. Asked if he is jumping on an easy target or that DM's tiny fraction of household waste means it is being disproportionately blamed, he retorts that this is not the case.

"Local authorities are picking up the tab for its waste. It's about time the DM industry paid its share," says Meacher. "I'm not attacking DM, it puts people in touch with ideas or products they might not think about. But producer responsibility is now an enshrined principle.

From 2006 car producers will have to collect people's old cars and recycle them. The same is happening in the newspaper sector - another mass paper industry. Yet it has achieved figures I'm happy with - 63 per cent recycling at the last count. DM is not being singled out any differently; it just hasn't made the progress other areas have."

So what of the specifics - such as who will have to pay in a producer responsible world? Printers and organisations like the Royal Mail can breath a sigh of relief after Meacher confirmed it will not be the clients of brands, but brands themselves that will bear the burden.

But Meacher said the government would not differentiate between sending mail to opted-in consumers who have requested the offending material and those who receive unsolicited mail. All mail must be dealt with by producers, and, says Meacher, if it means the cost of producing mail increases, then maybe producers might finally be more careful about how much they post in the first place.

"The industry considers a five per cent response as good. It has no care for the 95 per cent who don't want it," argues Meacher. "If increased costs force the number they choose to target to be refined, we will be doing them and consumers a service. I'm not trying to stop this industry, but producers have to recognise there is a cost to their actions."

The picture does not look good. Meacher says he wants the DMA to come back to him with a plan for how 70-75 per cent recovery could be possible, with provisions for how it intends to get members to pay for it. And it sounds like he means business.

"The DM industry is nowhere near where it could be. If we can't sort this out as a voluntary agreement, we have the power to resort to regulatory means. I don't want to see this happen, but it could."

RECYCLING - KEY FACTS

- Current DMA proposals call for 27 per cent recycling by 2005; 45 per cent by 2010 and 55 per cent by 2015.

- The government and newspaper publishers reached a voluntary agreement in April 2000 to ensure that recycling figures hit 60 per cent by the end of 2001, 65 per cent by the end of 2003 and 70 per cent by the end of 2006

- The government has set a commitment for 45 per cent of all rubbish to be recycled by 2015.